| User talk:Koszmonaut Sep 1st 2013, 01:35, by Porokello | | | | Line 83: | Line 83: | | | ::::No I'm not, I'm a mediocre hack and I reckon if you use the templates more you'll find a bug somewhere... but I'm glad you appreciate it. I don't know anything about Old Spanish, but I'll see what I can do. —[[User:Metaknowledge|Μετάknowledge]]<small><sup>''[[User talk:Metaknowledge|discuss]]/[[Special:Contributions/Metaknowledge|deeds]]''</sup></small> 04:39, 6 April 2013 (UTC) | | ::::No I'm not, I'm a mediocre hack and I reckon if you use the templates more you'll find a bug somewhere... but I'm glad you appreciate it. I don't know anything about Old Spanish, but I'll see what I can do. —[[User:Metaknowledge|Μετάknowledge]]<small><sup>''[[User talk:Metaknowledge|discuss]]/[[Special:Contributions/Metaknowledge|deeds]]''</sup></small> 04:39, 6 April 2013 (UTC) | | | ::::Update: I've created {{temp|osp-noun}} and converted all our entries. There are some entries which need gender or plural, so take a look at [[:Category:Old Spanish terms needing attention]]. For entries like {{term|foja|lang=osp}}, I have assumed that the plural is ''fojas'', but I haven't created it. (Plurals are accelerated like {{temp|nci-noun}}.) Now please make my work worth it by creating some more Old Spanish nouns! They are painfully few in number right now... —[[User:Metaknowledge|Μετάknowledge]]<small><sup>''[[User talk:Metaknowledge|discuss]]/[[Special:Contributions/Metaknowledge|deeds]]''</sup></small> 18:53, 6 April 2013 (UTC) | | ::::Update: I've created {{temp|osp-noun}} and converted all our entries. There are some entries which need gender or plural, so take a look at [[:Category:Old Spanish terms needing attention]]. For entries like {{term|foja|lang=osp}}, I have assumed that the plural is ''fojas'', but I haven't created it. (Plurals are accelerated like {{temp|nci-noun}}.) Now please make my work worth it by creating some more Old Spanish nouns! They are painfully few in number right now... —[[User:Metaknowledge|Μετάknowledge]]<small><sup>''[[User talk:Metaknowledge|discuss]]/[[Special:Contributions/Metaknowledge|deeds]]''</sup></small> 18:53, 6 April 2013 (UTC) | | | + | | | | + | == Hello, == | | | + | | | | + | I noticed you have knowledge of Classical Nahuatl. Where did you learn it? Sorry if I seem like I'm being nosy, I just find the language interesting. [[User:Porokello|Porokello]] ([[User talk:Porokello|talk]]) 01:35, 1 September 2013 (UTC) |
Latest revision as of 01:35, 1 September 2013 Welcome! Hello, welcome to Wiktionary, and thank you for your contributions so far. If you are unfamiliar with wiki editing, take a look at Help:How to edit a page. It is a concise list of technical guidelines to the wiki format we use here: how to, for example, make text boldfaced or create hyperlinks. Feel free to practice in the sandbox. If you would like a slower introduction we have a short tutorial. These links may help you familiarize yourself with Wiktionary: - Entry layout explained (ELE) is a detailed policy documenting how Wiktionary pages should be formatted. All entries should conform to this standard. The easiest way to start off is to copy the contents of an existing page for a similar word, and then adapt it to fit the entry you are creating.
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You are encouraged to add a BabelBox to your userpage. This shows which languages you know, so other editors know which languages you'll be working on, and what they can ask you for help with. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wiktionarian! If you have any questions, bring them to the Wiktionary:Information desk, or ask me on my talk page. If you do so, please sign your posts with four tildes: ~~~~ which automatically produces your username and the current date and time. Again, welcome! Ultimateria 21:56, 5 July 2011 (UTC) Huh?? Please explain your entry. Jamesjiao → T ◊ C 02:59, 26 September 2011 (UTC) That entry was a mistake, I'm sorry. I was not planning on saving it. Koszmonaut 03:03, 26 September 2011 (UTC) - I will delete this page. If you want to create a wordlist to work on, please use your own workspace, for example User:Koszmonaut/wordlist
- Very well, thanks.
We only use Category:Spanish noun forms. Use {{plural of|word|lang=es|nocat=1}} to avoid categorizing. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:57, 30 September 2011 (UTC) So, we know that these words entered Spanish long after the 16th century initial contact? --EncycloPetey 18:56, 8 October 2011 (UTC) - I was not aware that the categories were distinguished on the basis of when the term entered the language. I made the change with the purpose of having the terms present in the broader category (the current one). Two of the three terms present in the previous category were actually included there from entries where I had contributed the etymology. The Royal Spanish Academy's dictionary (which I consulted in this case) limits itself to tracing the etymology to "náhuatl", without providing a date. — Koszmonaut 19:13, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
-
- On Wiktionary we distinguish between Classical Nahuatl (pre-1600) and modern Nahuatl. We do the same for Ancient and modern Greek. Stating in a Wiktionary etymology that a word comes from Nahuatl means that it derives from the modern language, and not Classical Nahuatl. Yes, the RAE fails to make that distinction, and so cannot relaibly be used for that information. It is not so much a question of when the word entered the language, but which age of Nahuatl was the source, just as many modern scientific words are coined from ancient Greek roots. --EncycloPetey 19:59, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Spanish pronunciation[edit] In all your recent edits, such as for otredad, you've miscoded the pronunciation. For example, /o.tɾe.ˈðað/ should be /o.tɾeˈðað/. You've placed both a syllable break marker and a stress marker in front of the last syllable. Only one or the other should be used before a syllable, never both. --EncycloPetey (talk) 01:01, 28 June 2012 (UTC) -
- Right. I'll keep it in mind, thanks. Koszmonaut (talk) 01:06, 28 June 2012 (UTC)
Etymologies from Latin[edit] Deponent verbs in Latin have no active senses, nor active conjugation forms. It is therefore incorrect to refer to active forms of such verbs in etymologies. --EncycloPetey (talk) 05:09, 22 July 2012 (UTC) Minor note[edit] It's a lot more helpful if you leave your edit summary blank when creating a new entry, because then we can see the first part of it automatically. Thanks! --Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 01:24, 16 September 2012 (UTC) Looks like this could use a little cleanup, if you wouldn't mind. Thanks! —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 02:06, 23 December 2012 (UTC) - Gracias! —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 05:27, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Always glad to help! Koszmonaut (talk) 05:30, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Then could you do the alt-form puchtecatl too? I tried, but I really don't know almost anything about Classical Nahuatl... —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 05:43, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- It seems like you did all there was to do. Can't really add pronunciation because it's just an alternative spelling. What's the policy on creating the plurals of alternative spellings? The attestations I can find have the normalized pōchtēcah spelling (give or take the macrons). —Koszmonaut (talk) 05:47, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Normally, we do add plurals if attested. By the way, I think I can write a template that will allow you to create the plural forms with a single click, if you're interested. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 05:49, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Yes, please! I really have no idea how to go about creating templates. —Koszmonaut (talk) 05:53, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- There I go making promises I can't necessarily keep. But I'll try. I just need a noun where you haven't created the plural yet, and the plural has at least one macron in it, so I can test the code once I write it. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 06:39, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Oh, and I also need to know if there are any classes besides animate and inanimate, and if there are any regularly added pluralisation suffixes. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 06:41, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- And I need another test noun where neither the noun nor its plural have a macron. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 06:55, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- I'll get on the test nouns asap, I hope I can find a couple of useful ones soon. As for the categories, usually I include animate and inanimate for concrete nouns, because it determines pluralization, though in practice some agentive formations can have animate or inanimate referents. Abstract nouns are usually inanimate, or rather, aren't really animate or inanimate, they're just abstract. I'm no expert, though, might need to look into that. As for usual plural suffixes there's -tin and -h which can trigger reduplication and -meh and -queh which don't, also -queh is usually reserved for agent nouns. Overall, though, pluralization isn't really very predictable so I don't know how practical a template would be, though again I'm not the one programming, haha. I don't know if I told you what you needed to know, tell me if I just got you sidetracked. —Koszmonaut (talk) 07:16, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
-
- Honestly, I'm a crappy programmer, I just know how wikis work (I had to learn when I made my website). Anyway, all I got from that is that pluralisation is crazy and there's no damn way I can hardcode it, so you'll have to supply it as usual. I'm just hoping to save you some time. I just realized that I could just delete some plurals you've created to do testing, but maybe it'd be better if you created test entries for me. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 07:25, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Is oquichtli (plural oquichtin) useful? —Koszmonaut (talk) 22:12, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- OK, that worked. Can I try one with macra? —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:27, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- Oh, and usually we put quotes on the lemma form's page. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:44, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
- How about tōltēcatl (plural tōltēcah)? Also I'm not entirely sure what you meant with "putting quotes on the lemma form's page". —Koszmonaut (talk) 10:01, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
- (moving left) What I meant is, you put a quote at oquichtin, but since that's an inflected form of the word oquichtli, we'd normally put the quote there (even if it actually says "oquichtin"). For example, the quote at amarsir does not use that verb in the infinitive, which is the lemma form for French verbs. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 16:18, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
- Success! The template works! Now, go to WT:PREFS and mark the checkbox that says "Add accelerated creation links for common inflections of some words." Once you've done that, when you follow the instructions I wrote at
{{nci-noun}} (they might be unclear, if you have any questions just ask), the plural should become a greenlink instead of a redlink. When you click a greenlink, it automatically creates the entry, and all you have to do is click save (although you can add pronunciation first, too). If you see any bugs or don't understand anything, tell me. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 16:30, 24 December 2012 (UTC) - Understood. I moved the quotations to the entries for the singular forms, or at least did so for the two I remember adding.
- Seems simple enough. Thanks! It'll be helpful with some pages I had trouble with before. One thing, though, I don't know if this is a good time to bring it up, but because of how plurals are formed in Classical Nahuatl sometimes two or up to three plural forms for a single word are attested, is there a way to use the template to include these? —Koszmonaut (talk) 19:14, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
- Now you tell me this? I'll add it in, but first, are you completely sure that three is the highest? —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 19:33, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
- Sorry. From the wording in the source it seems like three is at least a rare occurrence, and in any case I don't think it could go over four for a single form. So three or four seems sufficient.
- I noticed the template doesn't generate parentheses after the lemma, as when using
es-noun, for example. I don't know if that's how it has to be in this case, but I think it's a good look and it'd be nice if we could have them for Classical Nahuatl too. —Koszmonaut (talk) 20:27, 24 December 2012 (UTC) - I did the parentheses, I'll get to the multiple plurals later (remind me if I forget). —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 20:50, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
- When using the
nci-noun template I've had an issue with words with no plural form where after the parameter for animate or inanimate it'll display a comma instead of a closing parenthesis (for example in cihuātlācamichin). Can this be fixed? —Koszmonaut (talk) 01:10, 26 December 2012 (UTC) - Dammit, didn't think of that. I'll go fix the code. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 01:55, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
- Hey, just here pressuring a little on the parenthesis thing. I've been using the
nci-noun code extensively (thanks again) so there are little end commas all over the place. —Koszmonaut (talk) 08:20, 4 January 2013 (UTC) - Oh, I've been such an ass to forget about that. Reminding me daily is not rude; it's often necessary. But now I must yield to the tranquility of sleep. It is on my (mental) to-do list for tomorrow. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 08:57, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
- Just did realized there's a way to do it without rewriting any of my horrible, messy code. Since I didn't put it off, that's means I'll never be a true lazy programmer. Anyway, that's done, now I have to dig up your other requests... —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 09:00, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
- Looking good! Thanks. You've earned a good night's sleep. ))))))))) –Koszmonaut (talk) 09:03, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
Sorry to bother you again, but could you clean up after this guy? Thanks —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 05:09, 27 December 2012 (UTC) - Now we're talking. What is the policy when distinguishing Nahuatl/Classical Nahuatl? Some terms such as ācalli and tlācatl are listed under Nahuatl but have quotations from sixteenth-century texts (Molina), for example. Should they be changed to Classical Nahuatl? And if so what do we do with forms which correspond to modern dialects and are listed in the same entry? –Koszmonaut (talk) 06:29, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
- As the only editor around here who cares, I reckon you'll have to make your own judgments and stand by them. Also, your expertise is requested at WT:RFV#athl. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 22:43, 21 January 2013 (UTC)
- I'm far from an expert but I've put in my two cents. –Koszmonaut (talk) 01:28, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
New template capabilities[edit] With the introduction of Lua to this wiki, we now have vastly increased capabilities in templating. Many ideas that were impossible or infeasible before are now becoming realities. As an example, I've changed {{nci-noun}} so that now you can enter the form with macra as pl= without needing to use plm= at all! For an example, see what I did at axolotl. If you have other requests/ideas, now would be the time to tell me while I'm still excited. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 00:17, 5 April 2013 (UTC) - !!!! Awesome. I think we'd discussed the possibility of a template for multiple plurals. I haven't been around as much so my memory's rusty but entries like ocēlōtl have two attested plurals, I recall encountering terms with three different plural forms but none come mind right now. —Koszmonaut 00:35, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
- OK, here's the news. I fixed all the entries that had plm= and removed the support for it. You can always check this link, which is currently outdated but which should update soonish. If any entries show up in the plm column, they'll need to be fixed.
- I also added support for two plurals using pl2=, take a look at ocelotl now. Do we need three plurals?
- Also, is there anything else you'd like? —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 03:12, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
- You're the best! A basic noun template for Old Spanish would be amazing, basically something with the same options es-noun has but for Old Spanish (so gender, feminine forms and plural forms). I basically cheated with entries like nuera, pharaon and uebos. —Koszmonaut (talk) 02:18, 6 April 2013 (UTC)
- No I'm not, I'm a mediocre hack and I reckon if you use the templates more you'll find a bug somewhere... but I'm glad you appreciate it. I don't know anything about Old Spanish, but I'll see what I can do. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 04:39, 6 April 2013 (UTC)
- Update: I've created
{{osp-noun}} and converted all our entries. There are some entries which need gender or plural, so take a look at Category:Old Spanish terms needing attention. For entries like foja, I have assumed that the plural is fojas, but I haven't created it. (Plurals are accelerated like {{nci-noun}}.) Now please make my work worth it by creating some more Old Spanish nouns! They are painfully few in number right now... —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 18:53, 6 April 2013 (UTC)
I noticed you have knowledge of Classical Nahuatl. Where did you learn it? Sorry if I seem like I'm being nosy, I just find the language interesting. Porokello (talk) 01:35, 1 September 2013 (UTC) 
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